New Code of Conduct for MakeICT

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For many reasons, we need a policy. Lets bring this discussion back to that issue please. Early on in this thread i posted an alternative policy. I said specifically what concerned me about the new policy and why the alternative policy was written like it was.
I don’t want to be labeled or prioritized by anyone, we are all just members and makers.
I don’t like anyone’s behavior prior to membership or outside of their membership judged by the space. And I believe, making accusations that cannot be proven or defended should Not be made public.
I’m reposting here my earlier alternative policy. Again, I am welcoming and encouraging critique and comparison to the passed policy for consideration.

Copy of earlier post:

What concerned me were the devisive undefined labels, prioritizing one member’s concern over another, the lack of due process and the public naming of the accused. To that end I propose a code of conduct that focuses on excellence, privacy and the 3 nerd rule:

Make ICT Code of Conduct proposal

All Members are equal at MakeICT.
All Members/Makers/Participants are expected to treat all other Member/Makers/Participants at MakeICT with respect, dignity, courtesy and civility in all maters and encounters.
Be Excellent to each other.

Issues arising counter to this expectation may be addressed to the “Committee on In-Excellence”
Which will consist of at least 5 members

The committee will evaluate the concerns and may at their discretion council or interview any or all of the parties involved in an initial attempt to resolve the In-Excellence. Each such occurrence will be documented by the committee and all documentation, interviews, counseling, resolutions and participants will be confidential and private, accessible to only the committee and the Board. At least 3 committee members will be involved in each reported incident and resolution attempt.

If the issue is not resolved to the satisfaction of all parties involved, the committee may escalate the issue to a private executive session of the Board. The Board, at its discretion and consensus may then take any action at its disposal to resolve the matter including suspension and expulsion of the In-Excellent member.

This type of policy does not label members, does not prioritize members, does not recognize forward or reverse In-Excellence, does not subject the organization to libel or slander, and provides a semblance of due process.

I welcome any consideration by members or committees and especially comment from those that disagreed with the policy just adopted and find fault with this alternate proposal.

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Hoo boy. Have you seen me in the hot shop at, say, 11pm?

I’m sweaty. I’m dirty. I look like I haven’t showered in a while because I haven’t (though I will when I get home, but you wouldn’t know that). I do, in fact, have “mental issues.” I’m wearing gloves meant for a man, a welding cap meant for a man, and sometimes other items meant for men. My hair is short and I’m sure as heck not wearing makeup.

Does that make me a man? Does that make me trans? Does that make me probably homeless? Does that make me a “cross-dresser”?

This whole trans panic is rooted in the idea that there’s a way for men to perform masculinity and women to perform femininity that is “correct,” and any deviation is therefore incorrect.

But that’s not how people work, is it? We dress and conduct ourselves however we want, and still reserve the right to identify as male or female or NB.

Because gender performance is socially constructed— it’s not like my genes or genitals told me to be dirty and sweaty and verge into profanity if I mildly shock myself while powder coating. :smile:

This means that yes, you (general “you”) will occasionally misgender people sometimes— even if you’re so-called “woke” AF.

That’s why knowing pronouns is important. Intentionally misgendering someone means using the wrong pronouns or dead name when you know the person prefers otherwise, and yet you refuse to recognize that as valid.

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I want to add one more thing about this. Yes it is like this everywhere. Im wary about being myself around my coworkers. at the superstore. at the bar. at church. even around my own family unfortunately.

So when I found an organization with a community that claimed to be “inclusive” and welcoming, you can understand why I would be attracted to it. and you would understand why I am now disappointed and feeling misled when I find out this isnt entirely true and when I see people on the forum fight so hard against having to respect people for simply existing.

Is it really too much to ask for one place in my life where I can exist without worry? Just because its like this everywhere else doesnt mean its good. MakeICT should strive for excellence, not to be just like everywhere else.

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Couple of other minor points:

  1. The policy should not be enacted until a review board is ready and populated.
  2. Policies should be as short and simple as possible. More details=more to argue about, more to defend and more to define.
  3. Policies should should be equitable and apply to everyone the same.

We have a lot to be thankful for at our makerspace, please help find a common peaceful resolution here.

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Brian,
The Code of Conduct is enacted, published, and in effect.
There’s a meeting of the anti-discrimination/anti-harrassment commitee on the 29th at 7pm in classroom 3 if you would like to present your opinions in some official capacity.
IMO, all respectful and honest comments are welcome on this thread.

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I stand with and support my fellow LGBTQIA2S+ Makers.

While I had some quibble with the mechanics of the Code of Conduct, I see the absolute need now for us to have one.

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While my views may be wildly different, I support the code of conduct because it supports and protects individuals who don’t feel comfortable in their assigned social construct (role). And ask to be treated equally.

I believe the issues that the LGBTQetc community, or even the handicapped community, minority or nerodivgent community… are all social issues. We have a social construct that says we will treat this type of person like this. Some people want to be treated differently. To have a ramp up the steps so to speak. There is no value in forcing someone into male gender roles just because they have a penis. If they want to wear a dress and be treated as a woman, they are still going to need help tuning their PID loop right? They can still build a chair regardless of what social label we apply. People are more interesting when you really get to know them. Let’s be a cool place where we just accept people. If they end up with regrets then they are just like everyone else. Hell I have regrets (especially after i eat at this paticular arby’s)

Peoples are peoples.

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I want to clarify that most of the people (including myself) in this thread that have issue with the new COC agree that we need a policy to protect members. Most of the criticism has revolved around the vague and devisive wording in the new COC. We are all supposed to get equal vote/ representation. I also think members should all get protections.
The new COC doesn’t do that. It states that certain groups deserve more representation. The board is NOT responsible for investigating claims, but they CAN publically accuse people of claims against them.
I support everyone being treated equally, living their lives how they want and speaking up when others speak offensively. I don’t think there is room in our organization for haters, and they should be punished if they refuse to follow guidance about pronouns/ respect. I want @PastelBrandy, @Bee and everyone else to feel comfortable and accepted at MakeICT.
With all of that said, I will be fighting to reform the new policy to be less discriminatory, and to hold the board members responsible to investigate claims and not publically accuse members blindly.
I have recomended MakeICT to LGBTQIA+ friends, younger friends and older family members.
I’m sure that as the COC evolves we will see an upswell of support from membership.

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I have many privileges. One of my privileges is to be able to step away from this discussion when the rest of my life calls. For some people, this topic follows them everywhere, because their entire being gets questioned everywhere, all of the time, for real, and not out of a concern of possible false reporting. Another privilege is the color of my skin. It never gets in my way. I don’t worry about interactions with police like I worry for some of my children’s friends. I know they’re good kids but I don’t know how the police see them. A third privilege is that I have been told frequently in my life how smart I am. It’s a very different thing for a child to hear “if Sherry didn’t understand it then I must have taught it poorly” than it is for a child to hear that they must have cheated to receive such a good grade. I can lace up my sneakers and head out for a run whenever I want, because I have the health to do so, and a safe neighborhood in which to run. The only time anyone has ever questioned my gender was when I had a pixie haircut (I have a great story about a lady in a nursing home who disbelieved I was a woman!) Those are just a few, there are many more.

Brian, I appreciate your work on an alternative. A few main points very quickly. First, there is almost no detail in the version you have presented so it doesn’t fulfill the main purpose of defining “be excellent”. And it is obvious at present that there are a number of people who don’t understand what “be excellent” or “respectful” even means.

Second, suggesting that we cannot enforce common decency in the absence of a committee larger than almost any we presently have, which will be harder to staff for multiple reasons (some folks don’t believe it in at all, some folks are too controversial, many want nothing to do with that much drama and conflict), would make the code of conduct with such rules as you propose completely and utterly useless. Membership committee which runs Maker Mondays and Membership Orientations (4 events a month) have exactly 3 members. Fundraising has 2 regular attendees and they’re both Board members. Communications has 2-3 who attend regularly, 2 of which are Board members. Finance is typically attended by more non-members than members. It is crucial that the Board be a backup for when there isn’t a committee.

Third, the phrasing of your policy proposals have suggested that discussion between harasser and victim may be used, or that everyone is meant to be happy at the end. Discussion or agreement between parties is a primary tool abusers use to control victims. The committee should not be expected to make everyone happy, that is either impossible or completely fake.

And finally, the current Code of Conduct does not prioritize members - it prioritizes the safety of marginalized people over other peoples’ comfort. The necessity of safety was reinforced again last night at New Member Orientation when new members brought up concerns of safety at night especially in the parking lot. Additionally lighting was a specific request.

@Ben.rogers - some of the phrasing you expressed concern about are exactly what we’ve already had problems with on this thread. There are rare times and places where a person could use discussing their own lifestyle to harass someone else (proclaiming their own superiority for one reason or another in an offensive manner) but it would have to be fairly blatant and needs to be left in. There is nothing in this document that makes one group superior to another.

We also need to be aware that just because a person is a member of a marginalized group, doesn’t mean that person can’t be guilty of harassment of other members of that group. Cis women can sexually harass other cis women, for example.

I have begun research on details we need in a Code of Ethics policy. Recusal and investigation etc. are topics for such a code. Remember that those are topics which affect other issues the board has to deal with, such as misuse of equipment and breaking rules involving safety, the guest policy, and makerspace security. For that reason, they belong in a separate code which applies to multiple issues requiring investigation.

And if someone is timing responses and critiquing the timing, they might keep in mind that we are all volunteers with lives outside of this forum and the space.

I hope everyone has a lovely day tomorrow.

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@Bee Sorry for trying to make you feel better.

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@Sherry I totally agree with all your points. I can’t understand why people can’t see that the new Code of Conduct protects everyone. It does point out some specific groups, but just because it does that doesn’t mean it doesn’t also protect everyone if they legitimately feel they’re being harassed. If everyone would just read and see the whole thing, and not just pick and choose a few points to focus on, they might realize it IS for everyone. Thank you and the committee for all your hard work on this. A detailed Code is needed and necessary when you have a large, diverse group of people coming together and the one the committee presented is a very good one.

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Quick thing to elaborate on Sherry’s point: we all have areas where we’re privileged and where we aren’t. Privilege is the state of not being encumbered by social difficulties that others experience.

Intersectionality is the idea that if you’re a gay white male, for example, you’re privileged in being white and male, but not in being gay, because there’s societal prejudice against LGBTQ folks.

So there’s an intersection of privilege and non-privilege going on there. In a society where there’s prejudice against a trait that you don’t have, you benefit by not facing that obstacle.

It doesn’t make anybody superior or inferior based on their relative points of privilege. It does point out areas where they have it easier or harder than other people, and that’s why it’s useful. But I understand why that’s not immediately obvious when talking about privilege.

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@Gretchen Well said.
I think most people do have some sort of privilege as well as something that others may be prejudiced against or at least not like about them. Some of those things are obvious and others are not at all obvious. Since we generally don’t know the details of other people around us, we should try to give all due respect to anyone and everyone alike.
But then you have some people who treat others badly, for whatever reason, and it’s hard to respect them. I’ve heard some people say, “that’s the way I was raised” and use that as an excuse for their prejudices. I think that’s an immature attitude. If we are mature, reasonable adults, we all have the ability to treat others respectfully, no matter the environment we were raised in. WE choose how we act and how we treat others. No excuses. And blaming someone else for our attitude and the way we treat others is immature and irresponsible.
Most of this has little or nothing to do with your comments Gretchen, but I just wanted to throw it in with my comment to you while I was writing.

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I’ve been reading this for a while, and I haven’t really had anything to say that hasn’t been better put by somebody else. But I wanted to thank the people who have been working to explain the policy and why it is important. I really respect you guys.

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When any entity; person,committee, or Board, is repeatedly informed that their speech and\or behavior are hurtful and that entity refuses to understand, compromise or alter their speech or behavior, that’s bullying. When its done from a position of power, that’s harassment.

This is why i said this policy codifies what it vilifies.

The board\space has a history of mismanaging harassment in the past yet this policy doubles down on that. Now they have given themselves permission to discriminate based on undefinable words and arbitrary forward and reverse - isms. They have permission to publicly announce an accused without the burden of investigation or due process.

There is a need for a policy and there is a need for compromise and understanding.

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Is it necessary that somebody agree with my feeling of oppression and harassment to make my feeling valid? Where does this policy address that validation. For examples, read above comments from several members.

Brad.

Who will define and judge “marginalized” and “forward and reverse” who decides the direction and prioritization of a harassment claim? Who will prioritize safety and comfort.
The space?, with their history, or the discriminators assigned for that task?
Where does the policy address that?

We need to listen to each other and find common ground that isnt so divisive.

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Brian, your feelings being valid doesn’t make your arguments automatically valid. There’s a difference. This thread is so long that “read above comments” is far too vague to know whose comments you’re referencing.

The situation you mention specifically began with a dramatic discrimination by leadership against two minority women, one of whom was never even spoken to prior to being reprimanded for doing absolutely nothing. That’s exactly why this entire subject got a foot hold. Everything else was mishandled by a lack of training and experience which all started during the last board. Things have improved A LOT since then because we’ve been doing the work.

None of the powers of the board have been added too, they remain exactly the same.

All of the words are definable. They’re also relative, so they will change from situation to situation. As has been addressed ad nauseam, we all have privileges and may have areas we’re marginalized. For that reason, we cannot create a simple list. (did you know, for example, that workplaces which are predominantly female are more prone to men being sexually harassed? Not that it’s automatic, just more likely to occur than a 50/50 or predominantly male workplace)

A code of ethics is where your concerns about the board belong. I’m more than happy to help you work on a code of ethics. My volunteer efforts are spread a bit thin, so assistance would be greatly appreciated.

Listening goes both ways. We need more volunteers to help.

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Unfortunately I’ll miss the meeting Tuesday I’m busy enjoying my fresh case of Covid instead. If anyone is zooming the meeting please let me know. I’d like to watch but I’ve already said all I needed to say.

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Hope you feel better soon and have a mild case @Brian We have a Google Meet link on the calendar you can join from. It’s semi awkward to use when the meeting is otherwise in person but I’ve done it before for other meetings and I always check to see if someone is virtual for the ones I host. If you’re late to the Google Meet by more than 10 minutes we might have shut it down, so shoot me a msg if you’re going to be late.

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I wrote a long reply. Buried in it was a sort of “coming out” . I choked and could not hit send but keot a copy.
I now wish to inquire; Is this a public blog?.I know I should not care. But am not ashamed and might someday tell you why… if you dont press me.

My leadership experiences span decades and is all team leading or shop leading. Not executive. Ok I have been in executive leadership of SMALL local sections of Chemists, Hispanic groups, Engineers, and LGBT. Always with a light touch among peers who are teaching ME during “my turn to lead” which we all got to rotate thru and try.
Most of my technical leadership was Shop SME and innovation encourager. Btw, I have had leadership failures. Painful memories. Im wiser now. In fact, nearly as wise as my Dad was. He taught by example … mostly.
May I stand among the regular one year old newbs and speak?
I promise you will like at least half of what I bring. [what do you mean, is that a wheelbarrow behind me? no, just luggage… ]

peace-out, peeps

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